Why not wait until it comes out to bash it?

I have played online games for a long time now.  Mostly, it has been MMO's, but in all online gaming, there has remained one constitant - people complaining about updates that are not even out yet.

I never understood it.

Hell, half of the time, the people complaining about it end up enjoying the changes.  They can rarely admit it, though, so they end up making excuses about why they keep playing.  And they lament about how the game is no longer '[insert game title here]'.

Which is blatently stupid.

Criterion Games owns Burnout.  As such, Burnout is whatever Criterion says it is.  Love it or hate it, that is simply how it is.  If Cagney ends up sucking all form of ass, and you loathe to play Paradise any more, then just stop playing.

It really is as simple as that.  If you hate it, or even simply dislike it, then quit playing it.  With the way Paradise works online, you will speak louder about your displeasure of the game by not playing.  All the bitching and whining in the world is not going to mean anything to Criterion when compared to that.

Do you have the right to compain?  Absolutely.  I have no sympathy for you, though.

Now, as for the changes between Revenge and Paradise, all I have to say is this:

Good.

I enjoyed all of the old Burnout games.  From the original to Revenge, to the two for the PSP, and now Paradise.  The only one I am missing is 2.  As much fun as Revenge was, Takedown was more fun for me.

I have found that each progressive game in the Burnout series has held my attention for less and less time.  Like many series, the games change as new ones come out but not enough to keep it from feeling like 'more of the same'.  This is why each game gets played less and less.  Some series do not seem capable of breaking away from their formula.

One series that comes to mind is Dynasty Warriors.  I have loved the series from the beginning, but their formula does not change very much.  Ever.  Their biggest change was from 1 to 2.  After that, playing 3, 4, 5, or 6 is the same game.  Sure, each game looks progressively better, but when how pretty a game is is the biggest change in a series, that is not a good thing.  I logged a thousand hours on DW3, but that time lessened with each game.  By DW6, I barely put 60 hours in.

The game becomes stagnent, boring.  If Burnout 5 had been just another game in the series, with the biggest change being graphics, I would never have bothered listening to the podcasts or looking for this site.  I would have rented the game (like I did), play it for a week, return it, and probably not buy it until it hit the 19.99 rack.

What is the point of this blog?  This:

1:  Saying Paradise is not Burnout is ignorant.  It is Burnout because that is what Criterion has decided Burnout is now.  If they decide Burnout 6 is going to be a first person shooter, then that is what Burnout will be at that point.

2: Ranting about an update that is not out yet is completely pointless.  Unless you wait until you actually have your hands on it, how do you expect anybody to take your ranting seriously?

3: If games never changes, it becomes stagnent, and then becomes extinct.

Comments

Rofer's picture

Needless to say i disagree, Paradise is lacking burnout gameplay, and unless they add in the burnout gameplay than i will not even try renting paradise just for the GCC. Every single complaint that i have had on the forums the burnout team did absolutley nothing about, and the things that i complain about is what the burnout community really wants, they don't want a new game with more and more new stuff whilst going the opposite idea of what burnout was originally meant to be. See people don't want more crap they just want all of the excitement that all of the old games gave us.

And for you calling me ignorant, i see you as ignorant just as much as you see it in me if not more, because this is really what i believe in, but it seems impossible for you to see it my way thats what i consider ignorant.

Wei's picture

You still refuse to see reality.  Paradise is Burnout for the simple fact that Criterion says it is.  It really is as simple as that.  If you cannot accept this, then you are ignorant.

"Every single complaint that i have had on the forums the burnout team did absolutley nothing about, and the things that i complain about is what the burnout community really wants, they don't want a new game with more and more new stuff whilst going the opposite idea of what burnout was originally meant to be. See people don't want more crap they just want all of the excitement that all of the old games gave us."

So, you speak for the entirty of the Burnout community?  Forgive me for laughing.

Okay, so you want the game to remain stagnent and never change.  You do not want new Burnout games, you want the old Burnout games over and over and over and over again.  Great!  Play the old games, then, and quit complaining about Criterion trying to keep their franchise from becoming old and boring.

Huh...  I guess my friends and myself, who have all loved the old Burnout games, must not be part of the 'Burnout community'.  After all, you speak for every Burnout player in existance, yet my friends and I do not agree with you at all.

"And for you calling me ignorant, i see you as ignorant just as much as you see it in me if not more, because this is really what i believe in, but it seems impossible for you to see it my way thats what i consider ignorant."

On the contrary, it is not impossible for me to see it your way.  However, just because I understand that you want Burnout Revenge 2 instead of a new game, does not mean that your stance is any less ignorant.  Your arguments run counter to both logic and reality.  That is why they are ignorant.

Oh, and nothing in your post at all does anything to counter what my blog is about.  Because you cannot.

Rofer's picture

You are a dumbass. There is no point arguing with you since you don't seem to be aware of the reality that people have different opinions than yourself.

I don't want the same game over and over again but if i had new tracks for the same game (Burnout Revenge) than i would consifer that to be just as good probably even better than a new game. Of course people don't want the same thing over and over, because they want to have it BETTER than it was in the past. That most likely meants that they want the same core gameplay as all of the previous games, plus more and more crazy speed and potetial and awesomeness and more wonderful tracks that you can't get from any of the previous games. That is not what i call the same thing over and over. That's what i call EVOLUTION OF A GOOD GAME.

'Oh, and nothing in your post at all does anything to counter what my blog is about.  Because you cannot.'

That is an extremely ignorant statement btw.

I know what the burnout comunnity wants because i am actually a part of it. Mabey your part of the paradise community but i consider that community to be anti-burnout.

Wei's picture

"You are a dumbass."

Oh, name calling.  The last resort to people with no argument.

"There is no point arguing with you since you don't seem to be aware of the reality that people have different opinions than yourself."

This is not about opinions, this is about people pissing and moaning about Paradise not being Burnout.  Sorry, but logic defeats you.  Paradise is Burnout by the simple fact that Criterion, who happens to, you know, own Burnout, says it is. 

That is not opinion, that is reality.

And yet, when I point out that reality, I am called 'dumbass' and 'ignorant' for knowing fact from opinion.

If you want to complain about the new Burnout game, then complain about it.  But insisting that it is 'not Burnout' is absolutely stupid.  Or, as you put it, 'You're a dumbass.'

"I don't want the same game over and over again but if i had new tracks for the same game (Burnout Revenge) than i would consifer that to be just as good probably even better than a new game."

Really?  Because it sure sounds like you want the same game over and over again when you complain about anything new being done with the series.

"Of course people don't want the same thing over and over, because they want to have it BETTER than it was in the past. That most likely meants that they want the same core gameplay as all of the previous games, plus more and more crazy speed and potetial and awesomeness and more wonderful tracks that you can't get from any of the previous games."

You do realize, of course, that the 'core gameplay' for Burnout has changed with every game?  I mean, if you really want to get to the 'core gameplay' of Burnout, then why complain about there being things like no aftertouch?  Why include takedowns?  None of that was added until Burnout 3, thus making them not part of the 'core gameplay'.

"That is an extremely ignorant statement btw."

No, it is an accurate accessment of your comments.  You have said nothing the refutes the following facts:

1: Criterion owns Burnout.  As such, Burnout is whatever Criterion says it is.  Whether you like it or not.

2: Complaining about things you do not have your hands on yet is pointless.

3: Games that stay the same end up going away.

"I know what the burnout comunnity wants because i am actually a part of it. Mabey your part of the paradise community but i consider that community to be anti-burnout."

No, you know what you want.  You might even know what your friends want.  But to say you speak for 'the Burnout Community' is the height of arrogance.

And because I like all of the Burnout games, including Paradise, I am part of the 'anti-burnout community'?  Sorry, but that is as blatently stupid and arrogant as you can possibly get.  When you pull your head out of your ass, let me know.

Rofer's picture

I won't be argueing any more except for one thing just wanted to say that I believe that burnout 1 through burnout 4 actually all do have the same core gameplay. In those games the fact that if you have boost than you can boost your speed directly up to it's top speed within seconds, and then your car either stays at it's top speed or goes faster as long as you keep holding the boost. it seems like they take a piss about that in paradies by giving the car infinite gears. And the handleing of the cars are terrible in paradise comparing it to the previous games. enough said

Wei's picture

Okay, so you do not like Paradise.  I get that.  That does not make it 'Not Burnout' any more than Revenge is 'Not Burnout' because I do not like it as well as I do 3.

You can complain about the handling, the gameplay, the boost, whatever you want all you want.  You can come out and say you hate Burnout Paradise.  I will not argue that.  That is your opinion and you are intitled to it.

But all this 'It's not Burnout' crap is just pathetic.  And when somebody dares say that it is Burnout, they get called stupid and ignorant for it.  And in the same post, you say I am stupid for not being able to 'see your side', then you call me 'anti-burnout' because I do not agree with you.

Enjoy your hypocrasy.

Rofer's picture

call it burnout all you want, i don't care. After all it is made by the same people who made the real burnout games, and they called this one burnout as well. The only point i am making is that it doesn't feel like an ideal burnout game to me, and to alot of other individuals, and that is the view that you need to see to let go of you ignorance.

Wei's picture

"The only point i am making is that it doesn't feel like an ideal burnout game to me, and to alot of other individuals, and that is the view that you need to see to let go of you ignorance."

I understand that you do not think this feels like a Burnout game.  I have said that, but you keep clinging to that argument because it is the closest thing to an actual argument you have.

Now, lets see if you can let go of your hypocrasy and ignorance and realize that I have understood what you have been saying from the beginning.  I just do not agree and am looking at this logically.

FrozenVapor's picture

People are complaining about Paradise in the hopes that Criterion will listen to their complaints and change the next game in the series.

 

Not saying I agree with that, but Rofer has a very legitimate point.

 

My main problem with Paradise at the moment is the incredibly retarded takedown system. You slam someone else's car and you get flung into the wall. And you can't even go for takedowns because of the distance delay - you can be slamming an opponent, but on HIS screen, you're actually a car length behind. Really kills the game for me.

What really pisses me off is how Criterion seems to care more about motorbikes and nighttime racing than the CORE GAMEPLAY. I haven't seen a single news feed about fixing the takedowns... maybe they're working on the physics, maybe not... but it's clear that most of Paradise's fans value "OMG new content" over what has made the previous Burnout games great - the battling and close racing.

 

I'm looking forward to night racing though.

ZombieTron's picture

Arguing semantics is completely pointless, and neither of you will convince the other to change their mind.

If GTA V came out with closed track circuit racing and no guns, a lot of fans would complain that it was no longer GTA. But, it would still be made by Rockstar and say GTA on the box, so it is still GTA.

Both points of view are valid. Now lets leave it at that before I get all Criterion on you and start deleting stuff!!

--- The Original and the Best ---

Wei's picture

"Not saying I agree with that, but Rofer has a very legitimate point."

The problem is, he never really made any points beyond telling me that I needed 'understand' his point of view, but saying I was stupid for not agreeing with him.

"My main problem with Paradise at the moment is the incredibly retarded takedown system. You slam someone else's car and you get flung into the wall. And you can't even go for takedowns because of the distance delay - you can be slamming an opponent, but on HIS screen, you're actually a car length behind. Really kills the game for me."

You see?  There you have made more legitimate points in that one paragraph than Rofer made in his whole argument.  And I really have no argument against it, as it is all your opinion of the mechanics of the game.

"What really pisses me off is how Criterion seems to care more about motorbikes and nighttime racing than the CORE GAMEPLAY. I haven't seen a single news feed about fixing the takedowns... maybe they're working on the physics, maybe not... but it's clear that most of Paradise's fans value "OMG new content" over what has made the previous Burnout games great - the battling and close racing."

With-out going into the core gameplay (which actually does change from game to game), they have addressed the flimsy takedowns in a podcast and have said fixes were on the way.

I actually agree with you on the point of the battling not being as good as it was in prior games.  I still do not think that Revenge was the 'ultimate' Burnout game, though.  Myself, I found myself prefering 3 over Revenge, and Paradise somewhere in between.

Rofer's picture

zombie, except GTA is sticking with their core gameplay of what made the series great!! Thats why GTA>>Burnout because GTA give their fans what theyh want :)) Ever since my first day playing paradise i could not stop thinking about GTA IV.

16 hours left!!!!!!!!!!!!!